Sweeping downhill turns

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equinox
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Sweeping downhill turns

Postby equinox » Sat Jan 31, 2015 11:56 am

While I enjoy Nordic skiing, I don't know much about the technical aspects of the sport. I learn by trial and error. I have trouble on sweeping down hill turns. Essentially, I don't know HOW to turn while in the shallow tracks I usually encounter. I figuratively stumbled on something while I was skiing in pretty good conditions today. When I was doing my turn, I assumed a "surfing" position. When turning right, I had my left ski forward and my right ski back. My knees were bent and my hips were turned slightly to the right.This made it easier to apply the proper turning force to my skis and help them track through the turn.
Is this a thing?

blckdmnd
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Re: Sweeping downhill turns

Postby blckdmnd » Sat Jan 31, 2015 1:50 pm

My downhill turns are a work in progress while skating. A lot of trial and error( and falls) as I am very much used to edging on a downhill ski and this doesn't always work too well xc skiing at speeds ( old habits die hard) I use quick steps to do a step turn, light feet and a relaxed posture for myself are what is needed. It may be just mental for me but I like to tuck and point my hands in the direction I want to go on sweepers. Seems to keep me feeling steady and consistent when I am feeling a bit tired. This all may be totally wrong technically speaking but it is what has worked for me. Hope this helps!

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nxski
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Re: Sweeping downhill turns

Postby nxski » Sat Jan 31, 2015 3:02 pm

blckdmnd wrote:It may be just mental for me but I like to tuck and point my hands in the direction I want to go on sweepers. Seems to keep me feeling steady and consistent when I am feeling a bit tired. This all may be totally wrong technically speaking but it is what has worked for me. Hope this helps!


That would be the appropriate technique for cornering. Step turns are going the be the fastest way to turn, otherwise you turn just like you would on a downhill ski, but you have to get used to the feeling of drifting rather than carving, which is especially tricky if the snow is chewed up.
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blckdmnd
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Re: Sweeping downhill turns

Postby blckdmnd » Sat Jan 31, 2015 8:48 pm

I have tried quite a few times to get the feel of a carve or edging or anything close on sweeping downhills, almost all of my training on snow this year is dedicated to climbing hills then skiing down them in the fastest way possible. Is there a certain way you initiate a drifting technique on a corner? I step turn as best I can but seem to fall behind and catch an edge on particularly fast corners, Hecklers Hill ( chewed up S turn that had 3 different lanes, or chutes to choose. Also full of Hecklers from the Snowmobile trail that intersects with the Birkie Trail) during the Birkie was one last year that was quite tense as well as the sweeping downhill just north of OO on the birkie skate trail seem to give me fits. I'd love to hear any advice of a way to set up a turn better or control myself better through the corner with speed.

Thank you for reply

-G-

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JeffOYB
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Re: Sweeping downhill turns

Postby JeffOYB » Sun Feb 01, 2015 10:53 am

It sounds like your first description was of a telemark turn!

Man, it all depends. It depends on the g-forces. Step turns, light feet if g-forces aren't extreme. But big fast power sweepers as in the Birkie often use a Flying Wedge. That hands-pointing idea is a good one. Wedge / snowplow with the outside ski. Hands low and to inside. If that isn't enough you'll then add skidding the inside edge of the inside ski. Have some decent flex in ankles and knees.

Unweighting then weighting can help initiate but that's more in quick turns.
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blckdmnd
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Re: Sweeping downhill turns

Postby blckdmnd » Tue Feb 03, 2015 9:30 pm

I have to admit I went out yesterday and was giving it all I could on the turns . The flying wedge is indeed the technique I was missing. I found the outside ski at a wedge to control and the inside ski more straight . I felt in total control and would alternate between that and step turns. Absolutely thrilled by the end of the day I wasn't even thinking of trying to check my speed. A big thanks for the help. It will definitely shave some time for me! :D

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Re: Sweeping downhill turns

Postby JeffOYB » Tue Feb 03, 2015 10:29 pm

Great to hear!
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Re: Sweeping downhill turns

Postby SpecialGreen » Sun Feb 15, 2015 10:18 pm

I tore a meniscus in one knee 12 years ago; could barely walk for a few months; took me about a year until I could jog 1 block. Just pressing the foot sideways against a wall or object was painful, so... no snowplow allowed. I switched to just tiny step-turns, and found that it was good enough (Noquemanon being probably the hardest turns I ski). And much faster than plowing.

I think snowplow can work when the snow is consistent (either all ice, or all mashed potatoes, or all fluff). But when you've got chewed corners with deep ruts, like at the Birkie, then when one ski hits a berm, it can catch and twist you hard... like a motorcycle "high-side" crash, when a skidding wheel starts pointing away from the direction of travel, and then suddenly gains traction.

With step turns, the skis are always pointed where you're going.


Speaking of sweepers, when I'm on skate rollerskis on a sweeper, I seem to corner tighter if I move my arms in little circles while I am step-turning. I imagine that it looks like I'm doing "the choo-choo train" (*) I can't think of any reason why it would help, and I don't do it on snow.

(*)the outside hand moves down and forwards a few inches while the outside foot is pushing


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