Anyone see Liebner's tip for Classic?

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JeffOYB
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Anyone see Liebner's tip for Classic?

Postby JeffOYB » Tue Feb 16, 2016 8:15 am

In the new Master Skier Annual, Andy Liebner has a report on a new way of doing classic striding. I wish there was a video of it! Has anyone read it and know what he's talking about? I guess I'll try mention some mainpoints but really the whole column might be needed.

I guess his main angles are that both poles are working at some point in the cycle -- the lead pole hits while the rear pole is still pushing to extension -- says the poling action is more like pulling rope, hand over hand. And also both skis are on the ground more so that kickwax is less of a factor. He also says both legs stay bent, tho front more than rear. Also he's bending over more at the waist. He says he's emphasizing kick a lot less and forward shift a lot more -- not a "weight shift" but a "foot shift." He says the glide phase is limited to the motion the arm makes from pole-plant to release. He includes a diagram that I don't understand at all.

He says he discovered this via a 360deg video treadmill session with Sten. But he admits that he's taken Sten's advice to an extreme. Says it's really comfy and relaxing -- for him. Suggests we try it, maybe use it now and then. He also said it's old-school from back when skis had less glide.

So I looked at the Falun 10k Men's final uphill and I saw that the two winning Russians were kind of doing that arm-action he mentions. The hands are kind of staying in front of the body in a rope-pulling motion. And maybe I see the "both legs stay bent" angle, too -- but not any extensive "both skis on the ground."

...Then there's a column by Dr. Jim S-G about these weird compression cuffs to stop blood flow and build muscle during workouts. YIKES! He says they're doing it but ouch it doesn't seem like what I want to try!
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Magnus Johansson
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Re: Anyone see Liebner's tip for Classic?

Postby Magnus Johansson » Tue Feb 16, 2016 1:35 pm

JeffOYB wrote:So I looked at the Falun 10k Men's final uphill and I saw that the two winning Russians were kind of doing that arm-action he mentions. The hands are kind of staying in front of the body in a rope-pulling motion.


This is probably dependent on pole length. What lengths do Vylegzhanin and Bessmertnykh use? Judging from the following video clip from the race mentioned Maxim Vylegzhanin uses remarkably short poles, not much longer than Sixten Jernberg in his days: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fykC9UcyyNo

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Re: Anyone see Liebner's tip for Classic?

Postby JeffOYB » Wed Feb 17, 2016 8:14 am

Right at 53 mins in this video you'll see V doing his "rope pulling" uphill.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kDBkR3r0rW0
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Re: Anyone see Liebner's tip for Classic?

Postby skiffrace » Thu Feb 18, 2016 9:42 am

Right at 53 mins in this video you'll see V doing his "rope pulling" uphill.

It simply looks like his poles are moving shorter distance and at higher tempo, perhaps with elbows closer to the body (but it could just be the camera angle).
Since more momentum is lost uphill than on the flats, faster, shorter strokes make sense to keep you going faster, especially if your poles are short.
As for the Liebner's "new way of doing classic striding" - can you provide a link or some other way of seeing exactly what's about?
Based on your description, it sounds like a made-up hogwash.

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Re: Anyone see Liebner's tip for Classic?

Postby JeffOYB » Thu Feb 18, 2016 7:07 pm

it's in the 2016 Master Skier annual. -- maybe it's online.
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